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[Pat Condell] Bad faith at Ground Zero

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[Pat Condell] Bad faith at Ground Zero

Bloomberg doing Shari Financial services??? Interesting. :chin: Then again the Saudis ( A vile regime ) schmooze with the Rothschilds. And our strange Royal Family.



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Why should a Cult not build a mosque because some other Cult and ideology accuses it ( without evidence ) of attacking buildings in New York.

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Oh fuck off Pat ...you shit stirring paid for shill :maduk:

a voice of reason .....





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Something gives me the impression that the Obama administration will cave in to popular demand and stop building the mosque / community /cultural centre. The thing is a huge hot-potato and the public don't want it.

According to Charlie Brooker of the Guardian... "Cordoba House, as it's known, is a proposed Islamic cultural centre, which, in addition to a prayer room, will include a basketball court, restaurant, and swimming pool. Its aim is to improve inter-faith relations."

Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ero-mosque

I can understand the motives behind building Cordoba House as trying to show America that Islam is nothing to be afraid of, and that Osama Bin Laden and Al Queda is to Islam as the Phelps family and the Westboro Baptist Church is to Christianity.

But the whole thing is too much, too soon and still an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers and Pentagon attack. If the project goes ahead, I can see some "patriot" putting the place to flame and endangering life in the process. More time must pass before anything like this can safely go ahead.

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Gunner 51 wrote:Something gives me the impression that the Obama administration will cave in to popular demand and stop building the mosque / community /cultural centre. The thing is a huge hot-potato and the public don't want it.

According to Charlie Brooker of the Guardian... "Cordoba House, as it's known, is a proposed Islamic cultural centre, which, in addition to a prayer room, will include a basketball court, restaurant, and swimming pool. Its aim is to improve inter-faith relations."

Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ero-mosque

I can understand the motives behind building Cordoba House as trying to show America that Islam is nothing to be afraid of, and that Osama Bin Laden and Al Queda is to Islam as the Phelps family and the Westboro Baptist Church is to Christianity.

But the whole thing is too much, too soon and still an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers and Pentagon attack. If the project goes ahead, I can see some "patriot" putting the place to flame and endangering life in the process. More time must pass before anything like this can safely go ahead.


How is it an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers?

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smeggypants wrote:Why should a Cult not build a mosque because some other Cult and ideology accuses it ( without evidence ) of attacking buildings in New York.


'Accusations' or 'Facts' aside, Why should anybody (Cult/Religion/Table tennis club or otherwise) be assumed the right to build anywhere?
The reason a Mosque should not be built in the immediate vicinity of ground zero should be quite apparent to anybody with a modicum of respect toward those who died there... Even if (and probably even more so) it is later proved that 9/11 was an inside job and 'Islam' had nothing to do with it, would still not make it 'dignified' to build a place of worship (to any faith) on a site of such suffering and death.
The only 'place of worship' that should be placed in that vicinity should be a memorial to those who died on the day.

smeggypants wrote:How is it an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers?


Well, whether or not the 'facts' are proven to be wrong, many people died in this area (of varying religions) under the name of Islam... whether that name was a lie or truth, people were murdered in the name of it.. as such, a place of Islamic worship would be an insult to those murdered.

As i stated on another thread of this nature... The solution is simple... Just build the Mosque a little bit further away displaying a little discretion and respect for the dead.

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Mr Squirrel wrote:
smeggypants wrote:Why should a Cult not build a mosque because some other Cult and ideology accuses it ( without evidence ) of attacking buildings in New York.


'Accusations' or 'Facts' aside, Why should anybody (Cult/Religion/Table tennis club or otherwise) be assumed the right to build anywhere?
The reason a Mosque should not be built in the immediate vicinity of ground zero should be quite apparent to anybody with a modicum of respect toward those who died there... Even if (and probably even more so) it is later proved that 9/11 was an inside job and 'Islam' had nothing to do with it, would still not make it 'dignified' to build a place of worship (to any faith) on a site of such suffering and death.
The only 'place of worship' that should be placed in that vicinity should be a memorial to those who died on the day.

So a Church, Synagogue, Hindu temple, etc would be just as offensive?




smeggypants wrote:How is it an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers?


Well, whether or not the 'facts' are proven to be wrong, many people died in this area (of varying religions) under the name of Islam... whether that name was a lie or truth, people were murdered in the name of it.. as such, a place of Islamic worship would be an insult to those murdered.

As i stated on another thread of this nature... The solution is simple... Just build the Mosque a little bit further away displaying a little discretion and respect for the dead.


I prefer innocent until proven guilty. There's no evidence ( of any credibility ) that 911 was committed in the name of Islam. One man's confession after being tortured over a 100 times is not something any proper court would accept.

What is a disrespect to the dead and their relatives is all the lies and deceit surrounding the event

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Yes, I do feel that a Church, Synagogue, Hindu temple etc would be equally offensive within this area and stated as much in my post.

As i said, truth or lies, torture or not, the people who died, died in the name of Islam.
Whether that was Islamic extremists carrying out a brutal act of terror against the west or the west carrying out a huge financial heist and blaming Islam is irrelevant as far as the dead are concerned. Only their respect and memory are deserved 'worship' in this area and those people should be put before any organised religion in my book.

Put another way....

Why is it sooooooo important that the Muslims get their Mosque in a place of such emotional sensitivity?
Why will building it just down the road where it would not cause such 'dismay' not suffice?

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Mr Squirrel wrote:Yes, I do feel that a Church, Synagogue, Hindu temple etc would be equally offensive within this area and stated as much in my post.

As i said, truth or lies, torture or not, the people who died, died in the name of Islam.
Whether that was Islamic extremists carrying out a brutal act of terror against the west or the west carrying out a huge financial heist and blaming Islam is irrelevant as far as the dead are concerned. Only their respect and memory are deserved 'worship' in this area and those people should be put before any organised religion in my book.

Put another way....

Why is it sooooooo important that the Muslims get their Mosque in a place of such emotional sensitivity?
Why will building it just down the road where it would not cause such 'dismay' not suffice?


its not "being built" its in an old coat factory four blocks away .....its not just a place of worship its a cultural center ...and there are other mosques ....one is just two blocks away ...should that be pulled down in respect of the dead ???

this is all about midterm elections and not sympathy for the dead ......its just being hijacked by the NeoCons to create a stink .




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annie27 wrote:
Mr Squirrel wrote:Yes, I do feel that a Church, Synagogue, Hindu temple etc would be equally offensive within this area and stated as much in my post.

As i said, truth or lies, torture or not, the people who died, died in the name of Islam.
Whether that was Islamic extremists carrying out a brutal act of terror against the west or the west carrying out a huge financial heist and blaming Islam is irrelevant as far as the dead are concerned. Only their respect and memory are deserved 'worship' in this area and those people should be put before any organised religion in my book.

Put another way....

Why is it sooooooo important that the Muslims get their Mosque in a place of such emotional sensitivity?
Why will building it just down the road where it would not cause such 'dismay' not suffice?


its not "being built" its in an old coat factory four blocks away .....its not just a place of worship its a cultural center ...and there are other mosques ....one is just two blocks away ...should that be pulled down in respect of the dead ???

this is all about midterm elections and not sympathy for the dead ......its just being hijacked by the NeoCons to create a stink .


And they are people who have no respect for the living

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No, i wouldnt expect the existing places of worship to be destroyed but there poses another question...

If the existing one is only 2 blocks away... do they need another one?


Mind, its like pubs i suppose... you need a few good un's in a few hundred yards to make for a good night out. :cheers:

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Mr Squirrel wrote:No, i wouldnt expect the existing places of worship to be destroyed but there poses another question...

If the existing one is only 2 blocks away... do they need another one?


Mind, its like pubs i suppose... you need a few good un's in a few hundred yards to make for a good night out. :cheers:



and the funder of the center is the largest invester of the NEOCON supporters FOX NEWS who are kicking up all the fuss ....are you getting it yet ???? they are creating the problem and making it the news .....thats how the media works
Problem Mosque ground zero
Reaction No No NO
Solution lets fight the Muslims .......
all funded by Fox News investor ... :D simples




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annie27 wrote:and the funder of the center is the largest invester of the NEOCON supporters FOX NEWS who are kicking up all the fuss ....are you getting it yet ???? they are creating the problem and making it the news .....thats how the media works
Problem Mosque ground zero
Reaction No No NO
Solution lets fight the Muslims .......
all funded by Fox News investor ... :D simples


The funder of the centre (Mosque?) is the largest invester of Fox News? :hmmm:

Besides, at no point have i said, "lets fight the Muslims".... i said "build it around the corner"

Compromise see?

Let the 9/11 dead have their 'sacred space' where they died and let the Muslims have their 'sacred space' around the corner.

I have said all along, its only an issue when people want it to be one.

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Mr Squirrel wrote:
annie27 wrote:and the funder of the center is the largest invester of the NEOCON supporters FOX NEWS who are kicking up all the fuss ....are you getting it yet ???? they are creating the problem and making it the news .....thats how the media works
Problem Mosque ground zero
Reaction No No NO
Solution lets fight the Muslims .......
all funded by Fox News investor ... :D simples


The funder of the centre (Mosque?) is the largest invester of Fox News? :hmmm:

Besides, at no point have i said, "lets fight the Muslims".... i said "build it around the corner"

Compromise see?

Let the 9/11 dead have their 'sacred space' where they died and let the Muslims have their 'sacred space' around the corner.

I have said all along, its only an issue when people want it to be one.


and thats what FOX have been doing ...making it an issue . No one would know or care if it was not for FOX NEWS .....they fund it and then make a news story out of it ....win win for the investor ....the sad part is most people read it as News and not propoganda to sell news ...keep in mind most of the large corperations that advertise on Fox also own/invest in the military industrial complex that produce weapons ....so war is good for them ... :thumb:

news is not to inform you its to change the way you feel .......




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annie27 wrote:
Mr Squirrel wrote:
annie27 wrote:and the funder of the center is the largest invester of the NEOCON supporters FOX NEWS who are kicking up all the fuss ....are you getting it yet ???? they are creating the problem and making it the news .....thats how the media works
Problem Mosque ground zero
Reaction No No NO
Solution lets fight the Muslims .......
all funded by Fox News investor ... :D simples


The funder of the centre (Mosque?) is the largest invester of Fox News? :hmmm:

Besides, at no point have i said, "lets fight the Muslims".... i said "build it around the corner"

Compromise see?

Let the 9/11 dead have their 'sacred space' where they died and let the Muslims have their 'sacred space' around the corner.

I have said all along, its only an issue when people want it to be one.


and thats what FOX have been doing ...making it an issue . No one would know or care if it was not for FOX NEWS .....they fund it and then make a news story out of it ....win win for the investor ....the sad part is most people read it as News and not propoganda to sell news ...keep in mind most of the large corperations that advertise on Fox also own/invest in the military industrial complex that produce weapons ....so war is good for them ... :thumb:

news is not to inform you its to change the way you feel .......



And it certainly succeeds.

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smeggypants wrote:
annie27 wrote:
Mr Squirrel wrote:
annie27 wrote:and the funder of the center is the largest invester of the NEOCON supporters FOX NEWS who are kicking up all the fuss ....are you getting it yet ???? they are creating the problem and making it the news .....thats how the media works
Problem Mosque ground zero
Reaction No No NO
Solution lets fight the Muslims .......
all funded by Fox News investor ... :D simples


The funder of the centre (Mosque?) is the largest invester of Fox News? :hmmm:

Besides, at no point have i said, "lets fight the Muslims".... i said "build it around the corner"

Compromise see?

Let the 9/11 dead have their 'sacred space' where they died and let the Muslims have their 'sacred space' around the corner.

I have said all along, its only an issue when people want it to be one.


and thats what FOX have been doing ...making it an issue . No one would know or care if it was not for FOX NEWS .....they fund it and then make a news story out of it ....win win for the investor ....the sad part is most people read it as News and not propoganda to sell news ...keep in mind most of the large corperations that advertise on Fox also own/invest in the military industrial complex that produce weapons ....so war is good for them ... :thumb:

news is not to inform you its to change the way you feel .......



And it certainly succeeds.


well I sure as hell hope people are getting the media manipulation going on .....news is a business for cash .




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smeggypants wrote:
Gunner 51 wrote:Something gives me the impression that the Obama administration will cave in to popular demand and stop building the mosque / community /cultural centre. The thing is a huge hot-potato and the public don't want it.

According to Charlie Brooker of the Guardian... "Cordoba House, as it's known, is a proposed Islamic cultural centre, which, in addition to a prayer room, will include a basketball court, restaurant, and swimming pool. Its aim is to improve inter-faith relations."

Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ero-mosque

I can understand the motives behind building Cordoba House as trying to show America that Islam is nothing to be afraid of, and that Osama Bin Laden and Al Queda is to Islam as the Phelps family and the Westboro Baptist Church is to Christianity.

But the whole thing is too much, too soon and still an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers and Pentagon attack. If the project goes ahead, I can see some "patriot" putting the place to flame and endangering life in the process. More time must pass before anything like this can safely go ahead.


How is it an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers?


Because those people died at the hands of a religious lunatic who practiced a very warped take on Islam. An Islamic or Muslim cultural centre or Mosque would be seen as a direct spit in the eye of those who died. Even though there are a number of Muslims who did die in the attacks.

I don't know what strain of Islam Osama Bin Laden followed, but people have picked up on the whole Islamic thing and now are afraid of it, or are wanting to fight it for whatever reason.

I guess what I'm trying to say is making a shrine to those who people deem to be mass murderers is seen as bloody offensive. Which is the reason you won't find statues of Stalin, Attila the Hun, Pol Pot or dare I say: Hitler down your local park or city square.

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Gunner 51 wrote:
smeggypants wrote:
Gunner 51 wrote:Something gives me the impression that the Obama administration will cave in to popular demand and stop building the mosque / community /cultural centre. The thing is a huge hot-potato and the public don't want it.

According to Charlie Brooker of the Guardian... "Cordoba House, as it's known, is a proposed Islamic cultural centre, which, in addition to a prayer room, will include a basketball court, restaurant, and swimming pool. Its aim is to improve inter-faith relations."

Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... ero-mosque

I can understand the motives behind building Cordoba House as trying to show America that Islam is nothing to be afraid of, and that Osama Bin Laden and Al Queda is to Islam as the Phelps family and the Westboro Baptist Church is to Christianity.

But the whole thing is too much, too soon and still an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers and Pentagon attack. If the project goes ahead, I can see some "patriot" putting the place to flame and endangering life in the process. More time must pass before anything like this can safely go ahead.


How is it an insult to those who died in the Twin Towers?


Because those people died at the hands of a religious lunatic who practiced a very warped take on Islam. An Islamic or Muslim cultural centre or Mosque would be seen as a direct spit in the eye of those who died. Even though there are a number of Muslims who did die in the attacks.

I don't know what strain of Islam Osama Bin Laden followed, but people have picked up on the whole Islamic thing and now are afraid of it, or are wanting to fight it for whatever reason.

I guess what I'm trying to say is making a shrine to those who people deem to be mass murderers is seen as bloody offensive. Which is the reason you won't find statues of Stalin, Attila the Hun, Pol Pot or dare I say: Hitler down your local park or city square.


Sure, but Islam is a religion, not a vicious human dictator.

There's no evidence of Islamists carrying out these attacks. All we have is the confession of one man Kalif Sheik Mohammed, which becuase it was extracted after 100s of hours of torture, is not somethign which can be taken seriosuly. There's no evidence Osama Bin Laden had anything to do with 911. While he condoned it he also denied involvement. These Islamists are usually quick to brag about being involved in these things. He isn't even wanted by the FBI for 911.

But let's just say for argument's sake Islamists did commit 911, it's nothing but prejudice to tarnish the whole of Islam for the actions of a few people.

As much as I dislike Abrahamic Religions the majority of the adherents are decent people and it doesn't seem right to paint their place of worship as a shrine to mass murderers. After all is every church a shrine to the Christian mass murderers?

What is a real affront and disrespect to the people who died in 911 and their relatives is a withholding of the truth. I find it disgusting that an Establishment is willing to kill it's own citizens for political and financial gain.

The American Establishment was quite willing to plan terrorist attacks on American soil in Washington and blame it on Cuba in order to give pre-text to invaded Cuba and remove Castro. Cuba used to be a safe haven for rich Americans to do dodgy dealings and Castro came to power and took those pleasures away.

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smeggypants wrote:But let's just say for argument's sake Islamists did commit 911, it's nothing but prejudice to tarnish the whole of Islam for the actions of a few people.

As much as I dislike Abrahamic Religions the majority of the adherents are decent people and it doesn't seem right to paint their place of worship as a shrine to mass murderers. After all is every church a shrine to the Christian mass murderers?

What is a real affront and disrespect to the people who died in 911 and their relatives is a withholding of the truth. I find it disgusting that an Establishment is willing to kill it's own citizens for political and financial gain.

The American Establishment was quite willing to plan terrorist attacks on American soil in Washington and blame it on Cuba in order to give pre-text to invaded Cuba and remove Castro. Cuba used to be a safe haven for rich Americans to do dodgy dealings and Castro came to power and took those pleasures away.


While ol' Ozzy B may not have crashed those planes, and there may be no "universally accepted*" truth to him actually masterminding the whole thing - but we've only got his word for it. Though if Wikipedia is to believed, the FBI think otherwise on this. (* Source: Wikipedia)

Even then, he could be lying to garner Islamic support for his cause. He did want a war between East and West, which he got

What better way to bolster support for his side than to appear to be innocent and say that he didn't start the war in Afghanistan by hitting the Americans first? But unfortunately for the both of us, there's no way he could ask the guy seeing how he's most likely dead or in an internment camp.

Though he wasn't hunted by the FBI for his crimes, it's the wrong agency for his kind of crimes. Such major crimes are chased up by the CIA or the NSA. Though I would take anything the FBI says with a pinch of salt in any case. (Unless I'm staring down the barrel of one of their guns *gulp* :) )

Like you said, if the thing was done by Muslim extremists - the whole thing has backfired on them and has made Islam look monsterous. Much like every other despot, dictator and idiot has done for their nation - they may not be a religion, but they sure had a following to execute the will of the big cheeses.

Hitler made all of Germany and Austria look like Nazis.
Pol Pot and the Khamir Rouge made Cambodians look like intelligence hating thugs.
Stalin made Russia the terrifying image people had in their heads in the Cold War. (Though the McCarthy propaganda didn't help things.)

But like you, I find it a shame that the families of those who died in the terrorist attacks on September 11th are being denied the answers they need - all in the name of national security, of course. Just make them sign a non-disclosure deal in private and Bob's their auntie's live-in lover.

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Hitler made all of Germany and Austria look like Nazis


and do you know how he got it going ???? or did he ??? :chin:







Holy shit :eek: ........amazing speech just brilliant :clap:
and they have done the same to the Middle east .....History repeats its self :(




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